I've been reading a book lately that has brought up some interesting questions considering the "theology of hell." A great question was posed that I believe holds great value and we should all consider what our answer to it might be....
If hell did not exist and there were no eternal consequences for my current behavior, would I still commit my life to loving and serving Jesus Christ?
Growing up I remember hell being a serious motivating factor for being a Christian. They used to show those cheesy "end-times" movies to scare you into following Jesus. But now I'm all grown up and I'm not so sure I buy the whole "Left Behind" idea. So now I have to wonder, if I hadn't been scared to death of the whole burning for eternity thing when I was young, would I have chosen this path? Don't freak, I'm not questioning my faith, just checking my motivations.
What about you? If you've made that choice, what motivated you to do so and what motivates you to keep doing so? And if you haven't, why not? Just curious....
Friday, September 30, 2005
Wednesday, September 28, 2005
DAVID CRUMM: Getting to the root of religion
Thanks to our old bass player Mike Broady for passing this article on. I totally resonate with with what this church is trying to do. Read on and maybe you will too...
BY DAVID CRUMM FREE PRESS COLUMNIST
The hottest preacher in Michigan this summer is a former punk rocker who's packing 10,000 people each Sunday into a remodeled mall southwest of Grand Rapids with a risky theology that offers as many questions as answers.
At age 34, the Rev. Rob Bell already stars in a popular series of direct-to-DVD inspirational movies called "NOOMA." In August, his book-length spiritual memoir, "Velvet Elvis," will hit stores nationwide from Zondervan.
But, sitting across the table from Bell at an Indian restaurant near his home in Grand Rapids on Sunday, he shrugged off any interest in fame. What matters, he said, is getting home for supper each night with his wife, Kristen, and maybe an hour of play time with his sons Preston, 5, and Trace, 7.
Anyone who has seen one of Bell's short "NOOMA" movies or has joined the vast crowd at the renovated mall in Grandville, called Mars Hill Bible Church, knows Bell is dead serious.
I drove up to see the church, because Bell has accomplished a feat that has religious leaders' jaws dropping: He's built a huge congregation dominated by 20-somethings, a group virtually missing in most churches.
"This journey we're on at Mars Hill isn't about numbers," Bell said. "You'll never catch me selling 'Seven Steps to a Mars Hill Model.' What we're interested in is real people stepping forward to tell how their lives are being transformed and how they're building healthy communities.
"Remember what Jesus always wanted to know?" he asked. "What's the fruit we're producing? Is justice being done? Are people sharing their possessions? Are the oppressed being set free? Are relationships being healed? To me, that's the point. Everything else is just chatter."
Since Mars Hill's founding in 1999, its charitable outreach has touched four continents. Now, the church is raising $1 million for AIDS relief in Africa.
"My theory of church growth is simple," said Bell, leaning across the table to deliver the coup de grace. "People drive a long way to see a fire."
Mars Hill's blaze may not be visible at first glance. There's nothing new about churches drawing casually dressed crowds by replacing pipe organs with rock bands and traditional altars with stages. That was news in the 1980s.
Instead, Mars Hill is a pioneer in a wave of churches nationwide that have little interest in décor. Instead, they're trying to rebuild the house of Christianity from its foundations. That's why Bell often preaches about basics.
On Sunday morning, I walked into the battleship-gray church, set up in the gutted interior of the mall's former anchor store. People settled into rows of plastic chairs facing a central stage, most of us curiously staring at the huge pile of topsoil in the middle of what other churches call the altar.
After 20 minutes of rock-style hymns, Bell walked up to the dirt pile in a work shirt. He lifted a handful of soil and retold the Bible story of God taking dirt and breathing life into the first humans. For half an hour, Bell talked about the wondrous nature of breathing, borrowing from Jewish, Christian and Hindu teachings.
He described breath as a form of prayer and urged people to relax and "breathe out" all of their anger and stress from the past week. He knelt and prayed, "God, we are fragile clods of dirt, and we need you to breathe into us hope and truth and love and courage."
Something in that earthy moment moved people in visible ways. One man near me cupped his face in his hands and used his fingers to wipe away tears. A woman kicked off her sandals and sat cross-legged as a beatific smile spread across her face.
As the service ended, parishioner Michael Sullivan, 27, of Grand Rapids said Mars Hill is the first church he's seen "that boils down church to the essentials -- just music and a message about what we're going through in our daily lives."
His friend Tina Boljevac, also 27 and from Grand Rapids, added, "And, Rob's honest."
He's so honest that the title of his memoir, "Velvet Elvis," is a jarring metaphor for how oddly out of date traditional churches appear to many young Christians -- like finding a painting of Elvis Presley on a black-velvet canvas in someone's basement, Bell writes.
That's how alienated many young people feel toward organized religion, Marcus Borg, a Bible scholar who has written several books on reinventing Christianity, told me later by telephone.
"In the religious studies class I teach at Oregon State University, I ask students to write down their impressions of Christianity and their adjectives include: anti-intellectual, judgmental and bigoted," Borg said. "So, I think Rob Bell's attempt to change this impression is exciting."
In Bell's envisioning of Christianity, he's also trying to bypass some of the feuds that have left many denominations deadlocked.
Women's ordination? No problem at Mars Hill. A third of the 15 associate pastors who work with Bell are women.
Homosexuality? Bell tells gay people the same thing he tells everyone who walks through the door. It's a powerfully affirming line that he repeated in his sermon on Sunday: "God loves you exactly as you are. Period."
The Rev. Brian McLaren, a pastor from Maryland who has become a national adviser to churches like Mars Hill, said: "Rob's one of the most courageous pastors in the country. What he's trying to do is move past the battle lines that have caused such polarization."
Bell seems well equipped for such tough work, growing up around controversy and jumping into the edgy life of a performer at an early age. He's the son of U.S. District Court Judge Robert Holmes Bell, whose controversial cases have ranged from the expansion of casinos to the storage of nuclear waste. And, even as Rob Bell went from Okemos High School to Wheaton College in Illinois and Fuller Theological Seminary in California, he moonlighted as a guitarist in punk bands.
When he founded Mars Hill in 1999, he named it after the spot in Greece where Paul of Tarsus preached to leading intellectuals and pagan leaders. Criticizing ancient houses of worship, Paul declared, "God ... does not dwell in temples made with hands."
At the restaurant on Sunday night, Bell wiped a final bit of curry from his chin and said: "The bad thing about a lot of theology today is that it works like a box. The church draws a square box around itself and divides the world between people who are 'in' and 'out.' I don't think that's what Jesus intended. He saw the church as a journey we take together. That's what interests me: the exploration, the relationships, the excitement of trying to discover this together. All I'm doing is asking people to come along."
BY DAVID CRUMM FREE PRESS COLUMNIST
The hottest preacher in Michigan this summer is a former punk rocker who's packing 10,000 people each Sunday into a remodeled mall southwest of Grand Rapids with a risky theology that offers as many questions as answers.
At age 34, the Rev. Rob Bell already stars in a popular series of direct-to-DVD inspirational movies called "NOOMA." In August, his book-length spiritual memoir, "Velvet Elvis," will hit stores nationwide from Zondervan.
But, sitting across the table from Bell at an Indian restaurant near his home in Grand Rapids on Sunday, he shrugged off any interest in fame. What matters, he said, is getting home for supper each night with his wife, Kristen, and maybe an hour of play time with his sons Preston, 5, and Trace, 7.
Anyone who has seen one of Bell's short "NOOMA" movies or has joined the vast crowd at the renovated mall in Grandville, called Mars Hill Bible Church, knows Bell is dead serious.
I drove up to see the church, because Bell has accomplished a feat that has religious leaders' jaws dropping: He's built a huge congregation dominated by 20-somethings, a group virtually missing in most churches.
"This journey we're on at Mars Hill isn't about numbers," Bell said. "You'll never catch me selling 'Seven Steps to a Mars Hill Model.' What we're interested in is real people stepping forward to tell how their lives are being transformed and how they're building healthy communities.
"Remember what Jesus always wanted to know?" he asked. "What's the fruit we're producing? Is justice being done? Are people sharing their possessions? Are the oppressed being set free? Are relationships being healed? To me, that's the point. Everything else is just chatter."
Since Mars Hill's founding in 1999, its charitable outreach has touched four continents. Now, the church is raising $1 million for AIDS relief in Africa.
"My theory of church growth is simple," said Bell, leaning across the table to deliver the coup de grace. "People drive a long way to see a fire."
Mars Hill's blaze may not be visible at first glance. There's nothing new about churches drawing casually dressed crowds by replacing pipe organs with rock bands and traditional altars with stages. That was news in the 1980s.
Instead, Mars Hill is a pioneer in a wave of churches nationwide that have little interest in décor. Instead, they're trying to rebuild the house of Christianity from its foundations. That's why Bell often preaches about basics.
On Sunday morning, I walked into the battleship-gray church, set up in the gutted interior of the mall's former anchor store. People settled into rows of plastic chairs facing a central stage, most of us curiously staring at the huge pile of topsoil in the middle of what other churches call the altar.
After 20 minutes of rock-style hymns, Bell walked up to the dirt pile in a work shirt. He lifted a handful of soil and retold the Bible story of God taking dirt and breathing life into the first humans. For half an hour, Bell talked about the wondrous nature of breathing, borrowing from Jewish, Christian and Hindu teachings.
He described breath as a form of prayer and urged people to relax and "breathe out" all of their anger and stress from the past week. He knelt and prayed, "God, we are fragile clods of dirt, and we need you to breathe into us hope and truth and love and courage."
Something in that earthy moment moved people in visible ways. One man near me cupped his face in his hands and used his fingers to wipe away tears. A woman kicked off her sandals and sat cross-legged as a beatific smile spread across her face.
As the service ended, parishioner Michael Sullivan, 27, of Grand Rapids said Mars Hill is the first church he's seen "that boils down church to the essentials -- just music and a message about what we're going through in our daily lives."
His friend Tina Boljevac, also 27 and from Grand Rapids, added, "And, Rob's honest."
He's so honest that the title of his memoir, "Velvet Elvis," is a jarring metaphor for how oddly out of date traditional churches appear to many young Christians -- like finding a painting of Elvis Presley on a black-velvet canvas in someone's basement, Bell writes.
That's how alienated many young people feel toward organized religion, Marcus Borg, a Bible scholar who has written several books on reinventing Christianity, told me later by telephone.
"In the religious studies class I teach at Oregon State University, I ask students to write down their impressions of Christianity and their adjectives include: anti-intellectual, judgmental and bigoted," Borg said. "So, I think Rob Bell's attempt to change this impression is exciting."
In Bell's envisioning of Christianity, he's also trying to bypass some of the feuds that have left many denominations deadlocked.
Women's ordination? No problem at Mars Hill. A third of the 15 associate pastors who work with Bell are women.
Homosexuality? Bell tells gay people the same thing he tells everyone who walks through the door. It's a powerfully affirming line that he repeated in his sermon on Sunday: "God loves you exactly as you are. Period."
The Rev. Brian McLaren, a pastor from Maryland who has become a national adviser to churches like Mars Hill, said: "Rob's one of the most courageous pastors in the country. What he's trying to do is move past the battle lines that have caused such polarization."
Bell seems well equipped for such tough work, growing up around controversy and jumping into the edgy life of a performer at an early age. He's the son of U.S. District Court Judge Robert Holmes Bell, whose controversial cases have ranged from the expansion of casinos to the storage of nuclear waste. And, even as Rob Bell went from Okemos High School to Wheaton College in Illinois and Fuller Theological Seminary in California, he moonlighted as a guitarist in punk bands.
When he founded Mars Hill in 1999, he named it after the spot in Greece where Paul of Tarsus preached to leading intellectuals and pagan leaders. Criticizing ancient houses of worship, Paul declared, "God ... does not dwell in temples made with hands."
At the restaurant on Sunday night, Bell wiped a final bit of curry from his chin and said: "The bad thing about a lot of theology today is that it works like a box. The church draws a square box around itself and divides the world between people who are 'in' and 'out.' I don't think that's what Jesus intended. He saw the church as a journey we take together. That's what interests me: the exploration, the relationships, the excitement of trying to discover this together. All I'm doing is asking people to come along."
Thursday, September 22, 2005
Our Need to be Busy
Our Need to be Busy. It's a silly title, I know. Who actually needs to be busy? A lot of us do....
In college I lead worship for a ministry called Open DooR. Yes, the R is capitalized on purpose. Our band was lucky enough to be given many opportunities to lead worship outside the ministry. A good friend of mine came to me once and said that a certain group was considering asking the band to lead worship for a retreat and she told them not to ask me. When I asked her why she simply said, "Because I knew you'd say yes."
Back in those days I needed someone to protect me from my "need to be busy." For some reason, in many of us, there is a certain fear that if we turn down opportunities that come our way we will somehow be less important. We've all bought into a lie that says we should feel guilty if our schedules aren't filled to the max. I used to even feel guilty for taking time to read my Bible and pray, as if there was something else more important that I should be "accomplishing." It's sick, I know.
Thankfully, somewhere along the way I learned to ignore my need to be busy and recognize my need to rest. I rarely need someone to tell me when to take a day off because I usually know when I need it and I'm not afraid to take it.
Lately I've discovered a different challenge to the "need to be busy" problem. Sometimes it's hard being a Christian and working in a church. My busyness is usually good busyness so it can be difficult to notice when it's more about my need to feel important than it is about doing what God wants me to do.
So now I'm trying to practice being a follower of Christ simply because I love Jesus, not because I'm paid to serve. If I'm busy serving, I want it to be about loving Jesus, not about growing my church and not about appearing to be a better, more important Christian than I really am.
In his book, "The Life You've Always Wanted," John Ortberg tells a great story about Pope John XXIII, who apparently had an advisor that was constantly telling him the problems of the church and the world, etc... The pope had finally had enough so he took the guy aside and confessed that he, too, was sometimes tempted to live as though the fate of the world rested on him. He was helped, he said, by an angel who would sometimes show up and say, "Hey, there, Johnny boy, don't take yourself so seriously."
In college I lead worship for a ministry called Open DooR. Yes, the R is capitalized on purpose. Our band was lucky enough to be given many opportunities to lead worship outside the ministry. A good friend of mine came to me once and said that a certain group was considering asking the band to lead worship for a retreat and she told them not to ask me. When I asked her why she simply said, "Because I knew you'd say yes."
Back in those days I needed someone to protect me from my "need to be busy." For some reason, in many of us, there is a certain fear that if we turn down opportunities that come our way we will somehow be less important. We've all bought into a lie that says we should feel guilty if our schedules aren't filled to the max. I used to even feel guilty for taking time to read my Bible and pray, as if there was something else more important that I should be "accomplishing." It's sick, I know.
Thankfully, somewhere along the way I learned to ignore my need to be busy and recognize my need to rest. I rarely need someone to tell me when to take a day off because I usually know when I need it and I'm not afraid to take it.
Lately I've discovered a different challenge to the "need to be busy" problem. Sometimes it's hard being a Christian and working in a church. My busyness is usually good busyness so it can be difficult to notice when it's more about my need to feel important than it is about doing what God wants me to do.
So now I'm trying to practice being a follower of Christ simply because I love Jesus, not because I'm paid to serve. If I'm busy serving, I want it to be about loving Jesus, not about growing my church and not about appearing to be a better, more important Christian than I really am.
In his book, "The Life You've Always Wanted," John Ortberg tells a great story about Pope John XXIII, who apparently had an advisor that was constantly telling him the problems of the church and the world, etc... The pope had finally had enough so he took the guy aside and confessed that he, too, was sometimes tempted to live as though the fate of the world rested on him. He was helped, he said, by an angel who would sometimes show up and say, "Hey, there, Johnny boy, don't take yourself so seriously."
Sunday, September 18, 2005
CRASH: A Rant...
This weekend I watched a movie called "Crash." You may have heard of it...it's fairly new and has several well-known actors in it. Anyway, the entire movie is about racism and the stupid things people and think and do and the pain that is caused as a result of it. The movie was engaging but I found myself frustrated through much of it for two reasons: Ignorance and Injustice...two of my pet peeves.
I can't stand to see people treated poorly simply because of another person's stupidity. I'm not going to go into the whole racial thing because that's a deeper subject than I care to dabble in at this current moment, and besides, in my line of work I see another type of stupidity more often than I see racism.
Religious Ignorance. I wouldn't classify myself as being devoted to any particular "denomination" per se. I've grown up in and worked in a variety of churches from Baptist to Presbyterian to Assembly of God to Church of God to Christian Church to Vineyard, etc... I don't hold any allegiance to any one over another. I agree and disagree with different points of the represented theologies, but big deal, what do I know anyway.
What makes me absolutely insane is when I hear things like this: "Oh she isn't Christian, she's Presbyterian." I'm sorry, did I hear that correctly? Because last I checked, we were all under the same "religion." Now, if you would have said, "Oh she isn't Christian, she's Buddhist." Well, ok then. Different God, different religion, got it. But SERIOUSLY!!
A while back someone told me that the Baptists don't put enough emphasis on baptism. The BAPTISTS don't put enough emphasis on BAPTISM. Is this what our theological seminaries are teaching nowadays?
By the way, don't bother trying to reach out and love people who don't yet love and follow Christ. No, it'd be better to send an outreach team to reach the Methodists instead.
I hope you hear the sarcasm in my voice.
OK, here's my point... I thought this whole thing (Christianity) was about loving Jesus and loving the people around us. At what point did that turn into condemning our fellow brothers and sisters in Christ for understanding things differently than we do? [And yes I'm aware that technically that is what I'm doing right now...]
Do you ever think that maybe...just maybe...we are human and none of us can fully understand the fullness of God's Word? Isn't that the point when it tells us that we can only know "in part." So maybe you've got it wrong and the Pentecostals have it right. Who really knows!
The point is that we all love the same Jesus and we all serve the same God and we all seek the same purpose...helping others know and love Jesus too. So instead of pointing fingers and acting like a bunch of ignorant people who can't see past our own egocentric view of life, maybe we could just love God and people and leave the theology up to Someone who really gets it.
NOTE: Before you leave me a comment questioning my faith, let me end by saying, I'm not suggesting that you don't hold tight to what you believe to be true. I'm not saying you should assume that truth is relative and everyone's ideas of things are ok. What am I saying is that within the Christian religion there are a variety of understandings regarding certain theological ideas. When someone loves and follows Jesus, don't condemn them for disagreeing with you. Like you, they are attempting to understand and follow a book that was written thousands of years ago in a culture unlike our own with writing styles that vary from todays and is filled with incredibly strange stories. With sincerity they are trusting God to give them understanding...again like you. Let God make the heaven vs. hell decisions In the end it's not up to us anyway.
I can't stand to see people treated poorly simply because of another person's stupidity. I'm not going to go into the whole racial thing because that's a deeper subject than I care to dabble in at this current moment, and besides, in my line of work I see another type of stupidity more often than I see racism.
Religious Ignorance. I wouldn't classify myself as being devoted to any particular "denomination" per se. I've grown up in and worked in a variety of churches from Baptist to Presbyterian to Assembly of God to Church of God to Christian Church to Vineyard, etc... I don't hold any allegiance to any one over another. I agree and disagree with different points of the represented theologies, but big deal, what do I know anyway.
What makes me absolutely insane is when I hear things like this: "Oh she isn't Christian, she's Presbyterian." I'm sorry, did I hear that correctly? Because last I checked, we were all under the same "religion." Now, if you would have said, "Oh she isn't Christian, she's Buddhist." Well, ok then. Different God, different religion, got it. But SERIOUSLY!!
A while back someone told me that the Baptists don't put enough emphasis on baptism. The BAPTISTS don't put enough emphasis on BAPTISM. Is this what our theological seminaries are teaching nowadays?
By the way, don't bother trying to reach out and love people who don't yet love and follow Christ. No, it'd be better to send an outreach team to reach the Methodists instead.
I hope you hear the sarcasm in my voice.
OK, here's my point... I thought this whole thing (Christianity) was about loving Jesus and loving the people around us. At what point did that turn into condemning our fellow brothers and sisters in Christ for understanding things differently than we do? [And yes I'm aware that technically that is what I'm doing right now...]
Do you ever think that maybe...just maybe...we are human and none of us can fully understand the fullness of God's Word? Isn't that the point when it tells us that we can only know "in part." So maybe you've got it wrong and the Pentecostals have it right. Who really knows!
The point is that we all love the same Jesus and we all serve the same God and we all seek the same purpose...helping others know and love Jesus too. So instead of pointing fingers and acting like a bunch of ignorant people who can't see past our own egocentric view of life, maybe we could just love God and people and leave the theology up to Someone who really gets it.
NOTE: Before you leave me a comment questioning my faith, let me end by saying, I'm not suggesting that you don't hold tight to what you believe to be true. I'm not saying you should assume that truth is relative and everyone's ideas of things are ok. What am I saying is that within the Christian religion there are a variety of understandings regarding certain theological ideas. When someone loves and follows Jesus, don't condemn them for disagreeing with you. Like you, they are attempting to understand and follow a book that was written thousands of years ago in a culture unlike our own with writing styles that vary from todays and is filled with incredibly strange stories. With sincerity they are trusting God to give them understanding...again like you. Let God make the heaven vs. hell decisions In the end it's not up to us anyway.
Friday, September 16, 2005
My Thoughts...?
Well, I told my husband I thought he was pompous for creating a blog...I mean who has time to sit and read someone's random thoughts and opinions on whatever they happen to be thinking of at the time. But then I thought that was mean so maybe I should try it myself...we'll see how well I keep up with it!
So, a little about me I guess...
The temptation is to start with my job because, well, the tendency is always to define ourselves by the work we do. But I don't really feel like my job is a very good indicator of my self, so let's ignore that for now.
I've been married for four years. My parents are starting to give up on the hope that I'll have children any time in the near future. I find the older I get, the more I enjoy my free time and the harder I find it to imagine myself with little ones running around. Not that I don't like kids, I do...but I like to give them back after a while! :) So, I've decided to get a puppy instead. In about 10 weeks I'll be getting a Miniature Dachshund and she is SO cute! But I hear pet-blogs are "out," so enough about her.
I have a love/hate relationship with my gym. I totally love the yoga classes I take. I feel so much better about myself and at no other time in my day am I able to quiet my mind in such a fashion. However, I have this desire to be one of those incredibly buff women you see and think, "She could totally beat the crap out of me..." and there are SO many women like that at my gym that it makes me feel fat even though I'm skinny! It's sick! I think it has something to do with being made fun of all my life for being skinny. For once I'd like people to look at me and be afraid! Ha! If you know me, that probably makes you laugh becaue I couldn't hurt a fly!
So...those are currently my two obsessions, my soon-to-be puppy and yoga. That and the new season of The O.C. Make fun of me all you like...it's entertaining!
Well, I think that's enough for my first post. Don't want to give away too much information! Might spoil the suspense! Lol...
So, a little about me I guess...
The temptation is to start with my job because, well, the tendency is always to define ourselves by the work we do. But I don't really feel like my job is a very good indicator of my self, so let's ignore that for now.
I've been married for four years. My parents are starting to give up on the hope that I'll have children any time in the near future. I find the older I get, the more I enjoy my free time and the harder I find it to imagine myself with little ones running around. Not that I don't like kids, I do...but I like to give them back after a while! :) So, I've decided to get a puppy instead. In about 10 weeks I'll be getting a Miniature Dachshund and she is SO cute! But I hear pet-blogs are "out," so enough about her.
I have a love/hate relationship with my gym. I totally love the yoga classes I take. I feel so much better about myself and at no other time in my day am I able to quiet my mind in such a fashion. However, I have this desire to be one of those incredibly buff women you see and think, "She could totally beat the crap out of me..." and there are SO many women like that at my gym that it makes me feel fat even though I'm skinny! It's sick! I think it has something to do with being made fun of all my life for being skinny. For once I'd like people to look at me and be afraid! Ha! If you know me, that probably makes you laugh becaue I couldn't hurt a fly!
So...those are currently my two obsessions, my soon-to-be puppy and yoga. That and the new season of The O.C. Make fun of me all you like...it's entertaining!
Well, I think that's enough for my first post. Don't want to give away too much information! Might spoil the suspense! Lol...
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